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User Comments - LightSpace/ColourSpace vs. Calman

 
 
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Author Steve

INF
Male
#61 | Posted: 21 Dec 2020 03:37 
This message we have just received did make me laugh out loud...

"I was considering buying ColourSpace HTL license to unf*ck my LG C9 after using Calman Home LG for a year..."

Steve
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#62 | Posted: 5 Jan 2021 08:27 
From another recent convert to ColourSpace:

Just wanted to say thanks for your amazing work. ColourSpace has allowed for a dramatically more accurate video reproduction and as a result absolutely stunning image quality. Far superior in every way to both Calman and Chromapure.

Thanks again!
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#63 | Posted: 9 Feb 2021 17:02 | Edited by: Steve 
From a user looking to upgrade to ColourSpace from Calman:
(And who has now performed the upgrade.)

I am an very disappointed user of Calman Home for LG, as I waste many hours to get a terrible result, ending with a lot of posterization and awful near black details. After googling and reading on AVS I found your software ColourSpace....

Unfortunately, one of those comments that we hear all too often...

Steve
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#64 | Posted: 21 Feb 2021 19:55 | Edited by: Steve 
From a 'Calman for LG' user who upgraded to ColourSpace:

As an LG CX owner, I first tried another calibration software but wasn't satisfied with the results. I gave CS a try and must say: it is an awesome tool even for hobbyists like me.

I wanted to give a quick shout-out to a few people who helped me get the best out of my panel: @ConnecTEDDD for taking the time (and patience) to reply to all my questions as well as for his excellent resources (be it the calibration disk or his plethora of articles on his website and helpful posts in this forum) and his guidance through the process; @liberator72 for all his guides and for his willingness to converse with a stranger and being tremendously helpful with his insights; @Anger.miki for his Genius dE2Kalculator, Steve from @Light Illusion for creating such a great piece of software & guides and @mrtickleuk for sharing his information on AWPs with me; everybody else in these forums for their willingness to share information and helping people to get the most out of their sets.

I now have SDR calibrations for dark (~100nits, Gamma 2.4) as well as bright (~200nits, Gamma 2.2) viewing modes that I'm happy with...

What's awesome in CS: the ability to generate different LUTs (Gamma, AWP, etc.) from the same profile. If there's something I could wish for in future versions: Detailed Reports, "Automatic" in the pattern generator settings being set by default
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#65 | Posted: 4 Mar 2021 19:12 
This is just one example of the many requests we get for quotes for ColourSpace from unhappy Calman users:

"Interested in Home calibration for personal use only, to cover all needed for LG CX, meters used are i1Pro2 and iDisplay Pro Plus... Let me know if you have an offer to get on the ColouSpace bandwagon, heard nice things about it from (name removed, but on AVSforum), and am very annoyed by Calman LG Autocal (too dark results) and inconsistent gamma target on re-measurement."

We get such emails almost daily, and always do our best to help where we can.
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#66 | Posted: 9 Mar 2021 15:10 
A general comment (on an independent forum), from a rather happy ColourSpace user:

"God I love this product. I moved my C8 (wall mounted YES!) and decided to recalibrate just for fun. I had 1 point DE 1.5-2.0 and the rest were below that for a rec709 2.4 calibration. Such a beautiful thing to see! I dialled in the SM white point a little tighter, as well before I calibrated. Absolutely loving ColourSpace and how it's evolving."
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#67 | Posted: 23 Mar 2021 10:33 | Edited by: Steve 
A few comments from another forum, based on ongoing Calman issues, and will they be fixed in the next release, after over a year of not being fixed...

"I was inspired to finally try SDR calibrating my 2019 LG 77C9 with CalMAN for LG after manually calibrating my bedroom 2014 LG 55EC9300 a couple weeks ago with HCFR.

With that said, the results weren't as good as I hoped for. Color Checker dE averaged 3.2 and dE max was 6.3. I assumed CalMAN would have no issues reigning in the Color Checker dE average to <1.5 and that my dE max would be <4.

I figured it must have just been a bad run so I ran another calibration, but received nearly identical results. I then moved my 55EC9300 next to my 77C9 and perceptually evaluated. I next carried my 55EC9300 over to my Sony BVM-D32E1W to confirm they looked similar and they do (aside from gamma). Both other displays were calibrated with the same colorimeter.

Also, I'm noticing some weird blockiness in low-luminance skin tone colors after running a 9^3 3D LUT. The colors are more accurate now, but I didn't see this when previously using the Lightning LUT.

It appears like red blocks and is easier to see in low-bitrate content but I also can see it in SDR 1080p Blu-rays. I calibrated Expert Dark to D65 and Expert Bright to .305/.322 and am seeing it with both white points (but slightly more pronounced with D65).

Does anyone know what would cause this and if there is a fix?"


To which the response was...

"Sign up for the beta"

Which generated the following thoughts...

"I bought Calman Home for LG about a year ago.
Had really fun at the beginning trying out all the features. But when I realized that all Autocal was providing was banding and posterization I asked for a refund. Did I receive one? Of course not!

So now I year later I'm sitting here with Calman Home for LG, still providing lackluster results and if I'm lucky(?) I might be able to get a working product before my 1 year support agreement expires in the end of April.

Doesn't seem like a fair business model in my opinion?"


And...

"Been away for a while...however seems nothing is changed.
For me and for my shark fins they offered full refund but I thought they could fix it at someday.
My 1 year license period is over and waste my moneys.

Luckily there is working alternative
"

As well as...

"Been in the same situation as you both, same issues, same outcome. I've since then moved to another calibration software, but my licence is still valid so I'm willing to give the new beta version a try to see if the long known issues have been resolved."

Which then ended-up with this post from one of the authors above...

"I'm considering switching to ColourSpace CMS from other tools. Is there a step-by-step walkthrough for calibrating an LG C9 OLED so I can see what the software is like to work with?"

To which the response was...

"Depending on what software you're coming from, you might be used to some kind of "automated" process. ColourSpace does not have that kind of functionality. This is intentional and a welcome change. But it does take some getting used to at first. The process for calibrating an LG OLED is fairly straight forward (so long as you don't forget any steps like SOME people around here LOL). Typically you won't be touching the 1D LUT at all and instead will focus on creating a 3D LUT. The end result is a beautifully calibrated panel. I'm definitely not the person to be discussing the process itself. There are many experts in this thread that may offer assistance with that. This is a REALLY amazing group of people. The effort to learn this software (which is EXCELLENT and keeps improving with every release) is well worth it.

NOTE: I started with another product that claimed to "automate" the process and was not satisfied with the results. Ended up here with ColourSpace and have never looked back"
.

And that gained this comment from another ColourSpace user...

"+1
also coming from autocal sh.t (deactivated, uninstalled, deleted - I will never install it again for all those resets, unplugs, non repeatable and not acceptable results - my CX deserves better treatment...). ColourSpace is masterpiece, believe me, although I am home amateur compared to lot of great guys here."


And this comment from another Calman user...

"Is HTL the correct licence to calibrate an LG CX using 3D LUT? I have been using PGenerator along with Calman Home for LG and an iD3 Pro Plus to calibrate manually but not getting good results even though graphs looks good."

For each "another/alternative" comment, read ColourSpace.

Steve
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#68 | Posted: 24 Mar 2021 10:32 
And the above discussion resulted in one of the Calman users upgrading to ColourSpace, and they had this to say:

"I already have to say that this is a massively different experience from working with your competitors. They are completely non-responsive by comparison. I'm excited to start using ColourSpace."

Steve
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#69 | Posted: 6 Apr 2021 19:18 | Edited by: Steve 
Another rather nice comment from a recent ColourSpace user, who has used number of different alternative programs:

"I finally started using CS yesterday! I must say I am absolutely, totally without question, highly impressed. The fidelity of the graphs is nothing short of remarkable. This level of finite information will be immensely beneficial and can only server to make me and my calibrations better. Some things I can do with this extra data are obvious, but I suspect I haven't even begun to scratch the surface of the new potential.

Anyway, thanks for all the R&D that has gone into this so far."


Steve
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#70 | Posted: 16 Apr 2021 07:42 | Edited by: Steve 
A user has just pointed out an issue with Calman's new colour engine:

"Originally Calman was pushing its Intelligent Resolution Profiling (IRP) approach, stating that 'every display has some nonlinearity, and IRP is the best 3D LUT process available for correcting nonlinearity...'
But, the new colour engine being stated by Calman as being a 'Completely new color engine built from the ground up using the latest color science research', is also stated as only working for 'MatrixLUT, LightningLUT, Fixed Grid 9pt, 13pt, 17pt, 21pt - IRP is not supported'.
Why would any colour engine have to be restricted in such a way?
When using ColourSpace, the ability to use any user generated patch set makes such a difference."


This really does say a lot about the true limited underlying capabilities of the supposedly new Calman LUT generation. Not only being limited to what are all fixed grid patch sets, but limited just to the sets in-built within Calman, as well as being limited to ONLY the TVs/displays/LUT boxes the 'colour engine' is compatible with... and there are a lot it is not compatible with...
That really does show there are serious limitations/problems with Calman's approach to LUT generation.
Why would any LUT generation be limited to any application, ever???

Steve
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#71 | Posted: 10 May 2021 10:23 
From a new ColourSpace user, learning the system for the first time:

"The interactive Software Manual is fantastic, Every piece of software should have a manual built like that."

The Interactive User Manual is here: https://www.lightillusion.com/colourspace_manual.html

Steve
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#72 | Posted: 24 May 2021 09:39 | Edited by: Steve 
We get messages very similar to the following on a regular basis. This is just the latest one...

"Hi Steve! I'm an existing (unhappy) Calman Home for LG user, who just recently got into calibration for my own personal use. I started with Calman Home for LG, and an i1Display Pro Plus paired with an i1Pro 3 Spectro, but I haven't been particularly pleased with the results I've seen, including from the newly released 2021 version. From increased banding compared to stock display modes, and colors that don't seem quite right, the experience hasn't been great so far. After conversing with other enthusiasts on AVSForum, I came across this software and have heard great things. I saw your trade up page, and was curious if it would be possible for me to trade up from my Calman Home for LG license, which was purchased in early March, to a ColourSpace HTL license? Thanks!"

And we do our best to help get such unhappy Calman users Traded-up to ColourSpace.

This customer is now a very happy ColourSpace HTL user.

"...everything is going great. I've only done the SDR calibration on my C9, but Ted was helpful in getting everything set up, and Leon over at AVSForum (who introduced me to Colourspace in the first place) helped me out with a few things I ran into while performing the actual calibration, but I'm definitely becoming more comfortable with the software, and am extremely happy with my C9 SDR calibration done with Colourspace, it's a significant improvement over anything I've personally accomplished or professionally had done with Calman in the past."

Steve
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#73 | Posted: 9 Jun 2021 18:22 
A rather descriptive post from a user that is very self-explanatory...

"With one year license of Calman Home for LG I didnĀ“t get good results, AutoCal produced nice numbers with low dE's but more or less artefacts with real material.
LightSpace and later ColourSpace solved that problem and offered great results."


Says it all really
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#74 | Posted: 14 Jun 2021 10:21 
From a professional calibrator:

"As the new Calman Aura colour engine is limited with the hardware it is compatible with I'm looking at trading-up to ColourSpace, as I know it has no such restrictions..."

The calibrator is now using ColourSpace PRO, having traded-up from Calman Ultimate.

Note: The restriction on Calman compatibility was pointed out by another user, as posted above.
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

Author Steve

INF
Male
#75 | Posted: 17 Jun 2021 14:36 
A simple message from the latest user to have Traded-up to ColourSpace PRO from Calman Studio:

"I am interested in ColourSpace. I expect I'll need ColourSpace Pro for probe capability (but please confirm) as I currently use a Jeti Spectraval 1501, Spectracal C6, and X-Rite I1 probes, with an expectation of purchasing a Klein K10-A within the next 1-2 years. I'm currently use Calman Studio and would like to Trade Up.... I've become frustrated with some aspects of Calman and want to increase my accuracy and efficiency."

Steve
Steve Shaw
Mob Boss at Light Illusion

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 User Comments - LightSpace/ColourSpace vs. Calman

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